November 6, 2009
Toyota workers in Buffalo talking union
CHARLESTON, W.Va. -- Some workers at the Toyota manufacturing plant in Buffalo are talking to their fellow employees about getting union representation at the plant that makes engines and transmissions.
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4GOD, was that directed at me. If so, then you are sadly mistaken.
Don’t include me in with the current crop of High School Science Educators, I was trained in the “old school” back in 59/62.
And yes, I have the knowledge and the ability and I applied said. And I could talk to you for the next 12 hours and wouldn’t begin to tell you all the things that I have done and/or acquired over the past 45+ years. Just the things that I have lost would boggle your mind. But that’s why they say divorces are like hurricanes. Clickety eer: http://www.freepatentsonline.com/3449735.html
"67% of companies do not pay fed tax." Are you speaking of income tax only or all tax, like FICA match? If that is so, why are they exempt? Fed income tax is charged on net income (profit)and not gross income.
"No Child Left Behind has dumbed us down." How so? The testing required by NCLB has pointed out the deficiencies in education. That was one purpose of the act to define shortcomings in education. NCLB also required the teachers be "highly qualified". Highly qualified means to have an education in the subject area the teacher is teaching. Attempting to remove math or science being taught by someone with a degree in another subject such as phy ed. Most teachers are required to "keep up" via renewal requirements or advanced degrees in subject area.
If education teaches 3Rs plus computer technology, the students will be able to survive. They will sort themselves out as to the level of success attained.
We must acquire knowledge through our entire lives. AS the base of knowledge grows exponentially, we become antiquated and left behind without keeping up.
If you are going to guide or teach, without keeping up, society would just as soon you not. The students will then be required to pick up, on their own, where your knowledge base acquisition stopped. Very time consuming and costly for business.
We now find ourselves in a situation called generation bypass. Some students acquire computer and technical skills that surpass the teachers before they reach grade school (they have desire). The worst part is they also go to the internet for their social, moral, ethical and other critical soft skills. So who is teaching them? So we put computers in all of the schools to allow like access to all, yet we do not teach the teachers how to use or apply any of this.
You have background, you have the ability to acquire; you just refuse to.
CAPTAINJOE, I would explain that to you but my post would only get DELETED so I see no point in doing so.
4GOD, did you get a chance to read my reply to your above question before the PC Police deleted it? I guess I really should quit mentioning the fact that I have a Degree even when posters accuse me of being uneducated.
Has Dan Rad come back to work for the CN?
I can't comprehend why you just don't get the "wages should vary with the profits of a company" so, I looked at Eastman kodak and confirmed they only vary wage dividends. In the example I gave, your entire wage/hourly rate would vary, not just the dividends.
Kodak corporation pays a "Wage Dividend," in which each employee benefits 'ABOVE HIS OR HER WAGES' in proportion to the yearly dividend on the company stock. The Wage Dividend was an innovation, and represented a large part of the distribution of the company's net earnings.
How do you, ever expect to grow,if you don't understand the basic concept of what is said before you comment/attack it?
We get more Federal subsides than any other state. We got more stimulus money.
Less people, more support; this defies logic.
Alt: over 67% of companies do not pay Federal Tax. State tax rates were lowered this year, most companies are located outside the state and are sheltered there. Yet you contend inefficiencies and taxes and wastefulness have forced job loss? The companies did not pay enough taxes in WV to cover their infrastructure and public impact costs. Where is your logic in this?
Government mandates. Some bad, some good and some are required to protect others (businesses and citizens).
Yes I am partisan. The neo-con philosophy is in no way related to the Republican Charter. They are Republican In Name only (RINO’s). They lacked the intelligence of a rock. A dumb rock at that.
Don't invest in telegraphs.
In your example to Captain you state 30% of gross on a $10 million the workers would get $3. The overall representation (for 2006) would be $27 trillion in gross and $151 billion in pensions and profit sharing. The relative percentage, in application, is 0.0056%; and this includes pensions.
Your last sentence tells me that you are afflicted with “tunnel vision” and thus are only looking at things through your Partisan Rose Colored Glasses.
Government inefficiencies, mandates, taxation and wastefulness have eliminated the majority of “lost jobs” over the past 50 years.
WV population 1950 - 2,005,053, …. 2008 - 1,814,468 with 66,075 State employees.
“Imagine two people packing up and leaving the state almost every hour of every day, and that would best describe West Virginia's migration over the years. http://www.wvdhhr.org/bph/oehp/hsc/briefs/eight/default.htm
4GOD, was nice place, was nice people, was plenty of opportunities. But no more. Bower is no more than a name on a few maps. No people, no houses, no Town. Just a few old foundations overgrown by the brush and trees. And several miles of coal mines that are now filled up with water.
Simple fact unions would not exist if it had not been for the actions of businesses. If you are looking for the root cause start there, otherwise we would all be paid in script and shopping at the company store (as OC pointed out). I will point out that I don’t like unions either, but I do believe in balance and looking at the entire problem; not just selected subsets.
Toyota: quit interfering with the employees. This will only promote the opposite desires. Let them get it out of their system and it will blow over.
Toyota employees: you got it pretty good; better think about this one very hard.
I will say the previous administration did what they had planned. Maximize profit. They just never thought about the other side of the equation; who is left to buy. Limited intellect.
Do I think the union was the reason the stamping plant shut down,..NO a company is going to do what it can do for its own interest. I dont know how many times at the plant I would go to my reps with problems I was having with management and nothing would be done. It got so bad that I stopped going. I was once told by our local President "I got a stack of problems 3 ft high and ur at the bottom of that stack."
So my advice is tread carefully
No, just a majority, same as getting union representation, at least in WV as those who are opposed to unionization are still forced to submit to union demands and dues if the majority votes one in.
And as far as trust goes, it’s not needed. The information is already out there. Getting compliance from the company side is nothing more then a matter of tweaking information that is already in place as all publically traded corporations have to adhere to SOX requirements and SEC standards among other government requirements.
The hard part is getting labor to agree to it and that ain't going to happen. The total lack of comment by on here proves it. UAW1002 spent days running his yapper about how a union was needed but he wouldn’t touch this subject with a 100 foot pole. No one from labor will.
It not only could be done, but should be done as everyone wins.
Health care would have to be addressed as they are not on board with anyone but themselves. Would problably be best to have individual insurance and let competition do its work to keep the costs down. But that brings up another topic, legacy costs? Another company crippler.
The gov is going to have to get involved in Health care regardless of what we do as its totally out of control now.
I threw out a challenge a couple of days ago to union supporters of putting production standards into union contracts and basing wages on the companies profit, including wage reductions and nary a peep was heard. That's why unions are failing now. Workers don't want a stake in the company, they want annual raises simply because they show up when they want to show up.
They certainly don't want a union that requires them to work through attendance policies that will terminate them over habitual absenteeism or tardiness with set standards of production and work to be done to receive their pay.
Why not start up their own business and pay themselves Union wages and benefits?
Excellent! People empowering themselves. One should never be entirely dependant on another. In other words don't place all your eggs in one basket. Another would be go back to college, or a trade school. Get into something that pays what you expect to make.
If money is your primary focus and you do not have your own business you should consider moving, as, there are a lot more oppertunities in other states. Hence the loss of our sons and daughters and brain drain in this state (promise scholarship recipients)
This would only work if there was verifyible trust, thru an open book policy and the percentage of wages for a position were spelled out in detail. Even then it probably would not work here as workers are not accustom to CUTS in wages and compensation. They would in fact start talking union. And thats where we are today.
“Like my old economics professor use to say, "wages should vary with the profits of a company". It sounded practicle, but I don't know of any that practice it.”
Key word in the above quote is VARY. If the company makes $10 million this year on average and they are dedicating 30% of Gross to wages and other compensation, the workers would get $3 million in wages and compensation to divide between them. If it make $100 million next year they would get $30 million in wages and compensation.
This is meant to give workers a stake in the company and a reason to see that it succeeds. Employees owning company stock promotes this as well, although nothing will get your attention faster than a reduction in your paycheck.
Again, It sounds practicle, but I don't know of any that practice it.
Ignorance is not a good excuse.
Kodak Corporation, Hobart Welding, dozens of Stock Brokerages and tens of thousands of corporations and small businesses pay their employees salaries plus Commissions and/or yearly Bonuses with the profits earned by the corporation.
Teddy OC, all for 1933, and like most everything else, I wouldn’t expect you to know much more than that.
The Town of Bower was named for W.H. Bower, assistant general manager for Henry Gassaway Davis, who built the C&C RR from the new Town of Gassaway, past the new Town of Bower and on to the old Town of Burnsville specifically because of the huge coal deposits on Copen Run,
“Bower had become a major shipping point for coal on the C&C. In the fiscal year ending June 30, 1907, Bower had produced 12,180 tons of coal, the first to be reported. For the 1914 fiscal year, this had risen to 143,927 tons, …” West Virginia’s Coal and Coke Railroad – Alan Clarke author
Forgive him Lord for he not knoweth anything about that which he speakith of.
The perpetuation of blatant ignorance through the populace only exacerbates the trials and tribulations of the ignorant.
Why not start up their own business and pay themselves Union wages and benefits?
Times are hard. AEPs talking about raising it's rates, we're in a recession and Health care is like a shark in a fish tank that has been chummed, and, "WE are the fish".
Perhaps after the recession, when things normalize, would be a better time to start asking for more benefits.
Hey, it's just a thought.
BTW in Japan, Toyota has a strong autoworker's union.
http://tinyurl.com/yfd3boh
Those who believe that unions are the downfall of manufacturing here in the US have it completely wrong. It was the gutting of US trade policies by self-serving politicians which killed off a once strong and thriving middle class driven economy. Our founding fathers established trade barriers knowing that they're vital for protecting our economy and our production
Before Reaganomics there were only about 1 million illegal aliens in our work force, but when he left office 3 million. Today there are over 12 million. Before Reagan the enforcement of laws against hiring illegals served as the barrier to their entry. During that same period union membership dropped from 25% to 7%
Bottom line? Cheap labor increases corporate profits
http://tinyurl.com/yakr7zy
It so happens that the Copen Gas Coal Company ran a company store in Bower http://tinyurl.com/yb8eeme
When the mines unionized, the company store normally shut down because union miners demanded to get paid in real money.
http://tinyurl.com/yefsa97
So Bower may have once been a thriving community, pal, but it never thrived until scrip was outlawed. Mining shut down in Braxton because the coke it was processed into was no longer needed to produce steel. Unionization had nothing to do with it whatsoever.
And yes, Vanwith is near Bower, but look at the timeline of its coal production, and then compare it to the timeline of unionization. The fact is that the UMWA struggled through the 1920s and was practically defunct right up until 1933 when Roosevelt's New Deal kicked in and the National Industrial Recovery Act was passed in 1933.
BTW in Japan, Toyota has a strong autoworker's union.
http://tinyurl.com/yfd3boh
Those who believe that unions are the downfall of manufacturing here in the US have it completely wrong. It was the gutting of US trade policies by self-serving politicians which killed off a once strong and thriving middle class driven economy. Our founding fathers established trade barriers knowing that they're vital for protecting our economy and our production
Before Reaganomics there were only about 1 million illegal aliens in our work force, but when he left office 3 million. Today there are over 12 million. Before Reagan the enforcement of laws against hiring illegals served as the barrier to their entry. During that same period union membership dropped from 25% to 7%
Bottom line? Cheap labor increases corporate profits
Perhaps, when a new company comes to WV they already know they can pay, oh say $8 an hour and have plenty of people jumping at the opportunity for employment. They can do this with little or no fear that the employees would unionize later, because of the anti-unionization attitude our fellow West Virginians have.
It's much easier for the people to leave the state to get a better job than it is to stay and expect to get good pay. But, for the ones that want to stay, what are they to do?
No one has seen fit to answer, Unless of course UAW1002 is stating the following as facts "*these are the times when you need to remember the coworker that was injured at work and was terminated or how you've been on an off shift and a temp has been on the more desired shift or how production has increased in numbers but the amount of employees hasnt.
* think of who made the decisions to take away that bonus, raise premiums on your insurance...did you have a voice in any of those decisions? NO! ", which I believe he is, having heard the same thing from a neighbor.
SamCougar, 4GOD, When the natural resources, The tax cuts, and cheap labor and CHEAP ELECTRIC POWER (AEP), runs out the company leaves, period.
Century Aluminum - they can pack up and leave right now as far as I'm concerned. They want AEP to give them cheaper rates and raise the power rates on peolple in Jackson county, while they destroy the union and pay as little as possible to their workers. Hasta la vista baby!
Simple logic. If the resources were currently there for extraction, why are they not being mined? Do you think a company would pay taxes on unutilized mineral rights? I guess the county could have given them such a cut in property taxes that waiting did not impact the bottom line.
Alternately , it takes less than 4% of the miners now to extract the same amount of coal. Remove 96 out of a hundred people and what do you have.
Manufacturing variables operate differently, just noting the comparison is invalid.
Then the “deprived” coal miners moved in from Clay County and organized a Union.
The Town of Bower is now but a memory and a couple old building foundations that one can still see iffen you know where to look for them.
There has to be a story behind that. Was it the “cost-of-living” differential that prompted your move to WV and now you have THOUSAND$ more in cash in your pocket at the end of the year?
“Oh, by the way, at my WV office of technology "non-union" job, the guy in the cubicle next to me slept in his office chair for days on end and nothing was ever done about it. ”
HA, do you think you told us something we didn’t already know?
http://tinyurl.com/yfd3boh
General Electric CEO Jack Welch publicly admitted that corporations naturally push for laws that permit them to "have every plant on a barge", and allow them to easily go to the country with the worst conditions to exploit
I'd just like to know who drafted that GOP health care bill amendment set up to provide US backed "sweatshop insurance" to the Marianas Islands. http://tinyurl.com/yls77lv
Those who push "free trade" over U.S. trade protections are supporting the corporate push for exploitable labor through globalization. The industry insider publication at http://insidetrade.com/ recently revealed that transnational corporations are planning to lobby against new trade regs designed to curtail the import of all goods made with convict labor, forced and indentured child labor
Oh, by the way, at my WV office of technology "non-union" job, the guy in the cubicle next to me slept in his office chair for days on end and nothing was ever done about it. This was clearly the managers fault.
You want to bear that responsibility? You want to cost over a thousand jobs just for the sake of a few people who feel so "entitled" that they will stop at nothing short of getting every single person laid off to see that accomplished.
Go ahead, be my guest.
That's a hoot. About the only politician today who has a like minded trade policy of our founding fathers as they advocated a non-interventionist foreign policy coupled with a free trade policy with any and all would be Ron Paul and his Libertarian political views.
Trade barriers of our founding fathers. I needed a good laugh today.
Thanks.
Before Reagan there were only about 1 million illegal aliens in our work force, but when he left office 3 million. Today there are over 12 million. Before Reagan the enforcement of laws against hiring illegals served as the barrier to their entry. During that same period union membership dropped from 25% to 7%.
Bottom line? Cheap labor increases corporate profits.
Japan was once a cheap labor country, but today it stands virtually at the top of the world wage table with wage rates between 10 and 30 percent higher than in the US.
BTW in Japan, Toyota has a strong autoworker's union.
http://tinyurl.com/yfd3boh
"By doing so they are interfering with our rights under the National Labor Relations Act to pass out literature. We are standing up for our legal rights and have asked the United Auto Workers for resources to help us address this issue."
workers rights have been violated.
I agree with sox, and efillc. And UAW1002 - Educate ourselves? Yeah, by reading Union propaganda? I was a former Union man, until I was busting my rear for absolutely nothing. I read that propaganda, and fell for it. And I won't make that mistake again. The SEIU ripped off my wife for more than $2,000 at the time she worked at a nursing home. And did nothing for the workers. Unions are no longer about workers, it's about the dues.
Toyota, don't be fooled by the Union propagandists. You will make a serious mistake.
GOODBYE TOYOTA!
I'm going to have to call a big Bull Shinola on that one.
18 holes with cart $55 $65 $75 $85
9 holes with cart $35 $40 $45 $55
Twilight with cart $45 $55 $60 $65
But hey since they used your money to buy it you get 20% off. How nice of them....
the UAW will not come in your plant, sign your cards, nor will they negotiate your contract.
I agree the Unions of today will not do anything for the working man. They are in it for the money. If your UAW had on once of backbone the entire UAW would walk out in your Cal. Toyota plant until this got solved. will they? NOPE.... You see it right here Buffalo plant you are on your own... Give us your money and we will ignore you.. If you need us look us up.
If the Unions operated like they did back when they started it would be different but this is the face of Unions today. A 33 million dollar golf resort. Bring back the days of Hoffa and Grandma Moses then I'll join your Union.
http://www.blacklakegolf.com/
*these are the times when you need to remember the coworker that was injured at work and was terminated or how you've been on an off shift and a temp has been on the more desired shift or how production has increased in numbers but the amount of employees hasnt.
* think of who made the decisions to take away that bonus, raise premiums on your insurance...did you have a voice in any of those decisions? NO!
be smart! take care of each other, STAND STRONG.
According to JD powers the most dependable cars for the last three years (2006 models) they place first in Subcompact, compact, midsize sport ,Full size Lux ,and Lux sport. They finish second in Compact and midsize (your Camry) not bad for a lapse in quality I'd say.
http://www.cars.com/go/advice/Story.jsp?section=buy&story=topDependCar&subject=most_depend&referer=&aff=national
While Unions are not the only problem. I fail to feel sorry for the guys who made $40 an hour for twenty years and now the well is dry.
As for these guys it is up to them Vote Union or not. They know what could happen, just don't ask me to boycott Toyota if they leave. If it will help you then vote it in
Corporations are conducting economic genocide against the American workers and unions. It saddens me to see so many people buy into corporate propaganda and embrace working against their own interest toward a lower standard of living. If we don't stand up for our rights,
we'll get more economic slavery.
American unions are formed the same way! THE WORKERS HAVE TO MAKE A STAND TOGETHER AND THEY ARE THE ONES TO FORM THEIR UNION! the UAW will not come in your plant, sign your cards, nor will they negotiate your contract. the UAW is ONLY a resource for workers. further more i think that there are several UN-educated comments about the UAW/UNION on here. research and educate yourself, don't rely on the media to give you your educated opinion! form the opinion yourself after you have done the research.
TO THE EMPLOYEES WHO TOOK A STAND FOR THEIR RIGHTS* GOOD FOR YOU! MORE OF US SHOULD STAND UP FOR OUR RIGHTS IN THE WORKPLACE.
Point being, whether or not a unionized Toyota plant can remain commercially viable is entirely dependent on the situation at hand. If it is, it is, and if it isn't, it isn't. Waving an ideological banner before looking at the facts is flat-out retarded. Let's remember, Toyota's recent lapses in quality occurred with NO union. Camrys, for example, are built at a non-union plant in Georgetown, KY.
Apparently the demise of union-dominated industries in WV (chemicals, coal, labor, etc) has had little or no lasting impact on the myopic vision of union bosses.
The $35,000 car that these engines go into will soon cost $50,000 or more if a union succeeds in organizing the workers at Toyota. Look at the city of Nitro (and the entire Kanawha Valley for that matter)...a shadow of what it once was since the unions drove Monsanto (Flexsys), FMC (Great Lakes Chemical), and other large employers in the area out of business. I was there...saw it with my own eyes. The organized labor largesse, the entitlements, the never-ending filing of grievances (real or perceived...mostly perceived).
Yep, Toyota will shut the doors and lock the gate if this unionization movement succeeds. Proof? Look at what's left of the Big 3 and UAW, and the skeleton of Detroit. Ford is surviving, but just barely. Pathetic...
Are you willing to accept a very strict attendance policy that terminates habitual employees for tardiness and missed work days?
Are you willing to accept a pay scale that is closely tied to a profit/loss margin, meaning if the company has a down year, you're willing to take a cut in pay?
Are you willing to control some of your health care cost by enrolling in high deductible health care plans, paying for preventative health care out of your pocket and shopping around to save on health care cost so the company can reduce its cost?
Are you willing to drum out poor performing employees instead of saving and fighting the company at every turn?
If you can say yes to these and similar policies, then I would say yes to a union. If not, adios, hasta leugo.
If you start that Union, good luck finding a job in 5 years. Toyota will be long gone.
bennysaunders89, the response to your challenge is DEAFENING.
YUP, and the School Administrators and Teachers in West Virginia have a Contract that includes Tenure Rights and guaranteed annual pay increases and which negates any fears of being terminated no matter what the QUALITY of the PRODUCT is that they push out the doors onto the public. The very PRODUCT that business and corporate managers must choose from to perform the work that the public requires 100% accuracy when it is PRODUCED. An oxymoronic "requirement".
So, if you want the same QUALITY of PRODUCT that the Public Schools produce then give all employees in WV the equivalent BOE Contract that school employees have.
Another thing many seem to fail to realize is no matter what you buy you are benefiting the local economy. When you buy a vehicle the commission made by the salesman gets spent at local restaurants and local retail stores and grocery stores further helping others in our area by supporting the workers at these locations. We may live in a global economy but where you buy is vastly more important to the people posting here than what you buy.
A union would have kept me from my promotion. A union would have the lazy workers get the same raise as me. A union would help save the jobs of the worthless people we get rid of.
If all workers are smart they will realize unions benefit union bosses, lazy workers, and people who are too stupid to make it on their own merit.
How's the weather in Mexico???
Modern day unions for the most part are political whores.
For all of you who say just quit and find another job, you do live in the USA, RIGHT? No matter what city/state you live in whether your in a union or not, auto industry or any occupation, people all over are losing their jobs. It is called bad management and competition. If my company is succeeding, than my workers should get paid for helping the company succeed. Why should I get to take a summer vacation because my company has succeeded, but not give my workers a vacation? It’s NOT fair. When you quit over bad management your letting the company win.
UNION YES!
Back in December, the glass workers' union (UE Local 1110 Chicago) sit-in was successful because it focused directly on the hoarding of the billions in bailout cash that Bush had then recently forked over to Big Finance with no strings attached. But nationally, the story of the union's success at getting even a small portion of the bailout money to trickle down to Main Street never got much attention in either the press or on capitol hill.
UPDATE HERE
http://tinyurl.com/y9jbxft
For far too long, disaster capitalists have been able to screw the middle class because of the corporate-owned media's obvious reluctance to report what a raw deal Wall Street gives Main Street
BTW unions are also one of the too few ways by which working class Americans can even out the overwhelming power that corporate lobbyists hold over those we elect.
Maybe the NHTSA has something to say about the floor mat issue...
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20091104/ap_on_bi_ge/us_toyota_floor_mats_3
i only have 1 question for you. when you purchased your home/vehicle did you hand shake on the deal with the bank? did you trust the bank would not raise your payments? was the bank crazy enough to loan you any amount of money on a handshake? NOPE! you signed a CONTRACT FOLKS.
I am a PROUD UAW MEMBER! i have a contract that gives me added protection and a voice at the table. when changes have to be made i get to be involved in those changes. i lose NOTHING unless i , as well as my coworkers, VOTE ON THOSE CHANGES. we are a VERY successful plant that is currently hiring! oh and i forgot to mention we have been organized for over 55yrs!!!!!!! SOLIDARITY FOREVER! UNION YES! standing up for fair treatment and fair wages/benefits WILL NOT BE THE DEATH OF TMMWV! stay strong and be proud! LET YOUR VOICES BE HEARD!
I encourage someone to please provide this example for me. I am limited in the scope of my research and would genuinely like to know if such a thing exists.
F.M.C.Chemical Plant in South Charleston--USW AFL-CIO
F.M.C. Ordnance Plant in South Charleston-UAW AFL-CIO
Volkswagen Plant in South Charleston------UAW AFL-CIO
Union parts Plant in South Charleston-----UAW AFL-CIO
Union Carbide in South Charleston---------IAM AFL-CIO
Aluminum Plants in Ravenswood-------------USW AFL-CIO
Steel Plants in Weirton-------------------USW AFL-CIO
etc.....
The Employees @ Toyota are too intelligent to vote in the UAW AFL-CIO, the UAW has sold out more workers in 2009 then any Industry in History.
The UAW AFL-CIO is a dying union and the UNION BOSSES are looking for more 'suckers' to send dues to Detroit.
Something doesn't sound right about this so I googled Biller. Seems he didn't decide to tell the truth until AFTER he was forced out by Toyota. On top of that, he's claiming that Toyota lawyers subjected perjury. Why didn't he come forth when that happnened?
http://www.aboutlawsuits.com/toyota-floor-mat-recall-could-have-been-issued-earlier-6268/
In addition to the recall, the company faces serious allegations that officials withheld safety studies and other evidence in Toyota rollover lawsuits in recent years. The allegations come from a former Toyota attorney, Demitrios Biller, who is suing the company for forcing him out.
Biller’s claims that Toyota hid the results of crashworthiness tests and told engineers to lie on the stand, leading to the re-opening of several product liability lawsuits against Toyota.
Say what you want about union labor. You cannot say that any union members are involved in design, vehicle development, engineering, or marketing of any vehicle. If management decides to build something, it is up to the assembly worker to put it together.
The Toyota workers in Indiana or Texas did their jobs....it's not their fault that some manager decides to cut costs by turning their back on issues that compromise quality or safety.
It turns out Toyota was aware of some issues like the rollover problem with some vehicles and the so-called floor mat issue now appears to be an engineering issue regarding the accelerator pedal and has nothing to do with the floor mat.
Toyota has tried to silence Demitrios Biller, a former attorney for Toyota that has decided to tell the truth.
Manufacturing vehicles that the public won't buy....Tundra, Sequoia, and Solara. The first two are big gas hogs that are just not fuel efficient and are not worth relying on in terms of devoting an entire plant to their construction. The Solara, just like most coupes are a niche vehicle that has a small sales potential.
The President of Toyota just apologized for failed quality, the recent recalls and the deaths of the family in California because of the floor mat issue. However, the Toyota plant in KY is hiring people through three different temporary agencies paying wages from $8.50 to $14.50 per hour. Without any benefits provided, the top paying temp jobs offer health care at $70.00 per WEEK and three vacation days per year starting out.
A new strategy in order to break people down is a two job rotation and discussion of using alternating shifts like the TMMTX plant.
Toyota, your employer will destroy you
"Our strategy moving forward is to base our hourly wages more closely with the state manufacturing wages where each plant is located, and not tie ourselves so closely to the U.S. auto industry, or other competitors," Sudo wrote.
That sounds strikingly simular to the Walmart stragety. Go into a place, estabish yourself, raise prices on your products give your workers that built your business nothing. It even goes one step farther, lets reduce the workers wages.....
I for one wont be buying another Toyota.
The F-150 remained the number 1 selling vehicle. #2-Chevy Silverado.
GM failed because they were paying starting wages of $28.00/hour and had legacy cost of over $4000.00 per vehicle. And in contracts years ago, they promised no one would be laid off due to technology so they were paying people to watch machinery work. Additionally, the ones that did get laid off due to low sales were put in job banks that paid 90 to 95% of their working wages so there was no incentive for union workers to make any concessions. Add that to the fact that GM put most of their plants under one contract, thus a secondary parts plant could strike and bottleneck 5 or 6 plants out of work and you have a company doomed for bankruptcy. Toyota will not make the same contract mistakes GM did.
Better take your jobs and leave now. Once these vampires get their teeth in you.......you're done.
Just look around at the business, welfare and state government climate in West Virginia, all proudly brought to us by the union.
http://www.govtrack.us/congress/record.xpd?id=110-s20071114-21
http://www.fedspending.org/faads/faads.php?&cfda_program_num=93.600&sortby=u&datype=T&reptype=a&database=faads&detail=2
pipedreams57, why ask a stockbroker? Ask the people who are being forced to pay the horrendous cost of healthcare. Ask the people who have had to file for bankruptcy because of medical bills. Ask Congress why Medicare and Medicaid are floundering in a sea of debt, graft, corruption and outright theft. Just ask Obama and the Democrats why they want a new Health Care Bill.
Given the above, SEIU should be THE most profitable industry in the US last year. But at what “fleecing” cost to the public?
BUT, …. BUT, …. gmhoover, and how do you know that the Ford vehicle you drive was not built in Canada?
“@rwc. It is not where the parts come from....it's where the dollars go! The tax revenues from Ford stay here....tax revenues from Toyota go to Japan.”
UH, …. UH, …. gmhoover, I will assume that was a typo error on your part, RIGHT.
Or did you mean that the tax revenues from Toyota goes to Japan via way of Washington, DC, to pay the interest on the money that our Government has borrowed from the Japanese government?
And it is no different than what Kroger has done for years n’ years. Many of their employees are part-timers with no benefits …… working side-by-side with Union employees.
UH, …. UH, ….pipedreams57, …. and just why did your college educated father and your mother take off down Hillbilly Highway to Georgia?
Do you think you could tell us why they did that? Why they just up and left these beautiful green mountains in West Virginia to eek out a living in Georgia? Seems to me a college educated person would have been smarter than to just up and leave these beautiful green mountains behind.
*for the workers at TMMWV that do not want to form their own union, research and educate your self. the united auto workers union IS NOT A 3RD PARTY ENTITY. they will not come to your plant and negotiate a contract for them, BUT YOU WILL NEGOTIATE A CONTRACT FOR YOU AND YOUR COWORKERS, that is if you do decide to stand with your coworkers to form a union!
as i read the comments posted about what a union or namely the UAW will do if the workers decide to card check, i found a lot of lies or misinformed comments....... i am a UAW MEMBER and i have a voice at my workplace. my workplace is thriving. my plant is hiring and currently working overtime to satisfy our customers. we, at my plant, work hand in hand with management. we want our company to be the best, both company and union employees!
SOLIDARITY! UNION YES!
Camp one is stongly pro-union. They are the loudest of the union supporters and are proud of it.
Camp two is strongly anti-union. They are as strongly against the union organizers as the company.
Camp three is riding the fence. They are smart enough to see what happened to the Big 3 and know that there is enough blame to go around. They're gonna do what is best for them and thier families be it pro or anti union.
You can't pin the failure of the big 3 on the blue collar crowd. Corporate planning put all the eggs in the SuV/Truck basket and when gas prices soared they failed. They had no viable car/crossover products to capitalize on the swing to fuel efficient vehicles. Toyota is famous for quality and fuel efficency. They sale cars based solely on that reputation. Sometimes even when a comparable US made car is less expensive, equal quality, and more fuel efficient.
The UAW will not organize TMMWV anytime soon.
Toyota unions eye ¥1,000 raise
Saturday, Jan. 19, 2008
NAGOYA (Kyodo) The federation of labor unions of Toyota Motor Corp. group companies plan to seek a base pay increase of at least ¥1,000 in this year's "shunto" spring wage negotiations, federation officials said Friday.
It will be the first time in six years that the Federation of All Toyota Workers' Unions has demanded a hike in the basic monthly wage with a specific figure.
The umbrella body, consisting of 292 unions with 290,000 members, will finalize the plan at a meeting starting in Tokyo on Friday.
Among the unions under the federation, the Toyota Motor Workers' Union plans to demand a ¥1,500 pay increase.
The plan is in line with the decision by the Confederation of Japan Automobile Workers' Unions, the industrywide umbrella body, to demand a pay hike of ¥1,000 or more.
MORE HERE
http://tinyurl.com/yfd3boh
A union brings more than just higher wages and better benefits. It brings respect! It means dignity.
Solidarity and good luck!
Chrysler bailed out by the US Government and still went bankrupt.
Ford was saved by overseas production or they would have been bailed out by the US Government and went bankrupt.
Union. yea...
Please cite, in specific examples, one major long-term unionized industrial operation in West Virginia that is both currently profitable and not subsidized by the United States government in any way.
Thanks,
Not Morons Everywhere
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Then I’m not sure what you’re going to drive. Ford’s headquarters may be in Michigan but their profits come from overseas manufacturing, primarily Asia. It’s the only reason Ford wasn’t forced to take stimulus money to begin with as their US facilities lose just as much as GM and Chrysler and as such, their tax burden is lessened.
As for Toyota, it is a subsidiary of a foreign owned company and is taxed as such. The way I see it, if it’s made in West Virginia by West Virginians and TMMWV pays taxes here, which they do, it’s a US car. And on top of that, they pay MORE taxes to the state of West Virginia then Ford does so they’re BETTER for West Virginia then Ford is.
And, not content with facilitating the financial implosion of GM and Chrysler, the UAW now has its sights set upon any auto manufacturing facility in the U.S., regardless of its ownership.
The solution for Toyota is simple: Shut down all U.S. manufacturing facilities and relocate them within countries in which workers remain dedicated to their duties--NOT to their "rights".
Read the comments below from people who work there. Obviously it's not such a great job as it was a few years ago. Salaries are being cut. If Toyota is doing such a good job with its employees, it would have nothing to fear in letting people pass out union literature.
It's a simple choice. It really doesn't help your relations with your staff if you act like you want to keep things from them. They won't join the union if they have nothing to gain.
Below gmhoover talks of how Toyota uses Manpower to work employees at reduced wages and this is true. Manpower got the contract about 5 or 6 years ago and that became their focal point of business.
What I want to know is how that’s any different the Rite Aid working employees for 28 days, sending the home for a week and then calling them back for another 3 weeks simply to keep them out of the union? Or different then UPS working employees part time on split shifts for years before giving them a chance to join the union the full time.
The point is, Toyota isn't doing anything that UNIONS in this valley weren't already doing when they came to town.
The employees can unionize but nothing can force Toyota to stay in Buffalo and card check won't change that.
Toyota has 13 manufacturing facilities in the United States, 3 of which are already union, thus in my humble opinion, Toyota is as much an American car as Ford is.
It is more important now, than ever, for workers to stand together, to protect ourselves and our families with fair contracts. Toyota management are puppets to the corporate greed permeating throughout America today. As citizens and workers of this great country, I say...enough is enough....we are fighting mad!! Go get them Toyota workers! GO UAW!!
(P.S.- all you anti-union posters...take your head out of the sand to what is happening in our country today! You should be ashamed of yourselves!!)
Ask why coal mine employees at all non union coal mines are NOT joining a union ! Then ask "any" UMW representative why they CANNOT organize these non union companies !
Ask why non union freight and small package trucking company employees are NOT joining a union ! Then ask "any" Teamster union representative why they CANNOT organize "any" non union trucking company !
And last but not least. Ask the author of this story ( Paul Nyden) about why he has never written any articles of corruption in unions ? He claims he is a "investigative" reporter ! The ask Nyden why the very newspaper he represents does NOT have union employees ? Then ask Nyden why he has such a "close" tied association with UMW and Teamster representatives ?
Why ? Paul Nyden carries these unions water to promote their socialist agendas !
How many of you would be happy to have your wages cut?
Hopefully they only emulated the good business practices of big three. Hopefully they haven't followed the big threes lead when it comes to management pay.
However, When you are throwing 6 figure salaries around like candy to a few (LIKE THE BIG THREE) and complaining that you have to pay your workers $40-50K your not going to get any sympathy from me.
Hopefully they are going to keep their uncanny sense for attention to detail. Thats the main reason I bought a toyota last year. QUALITY!
Point is, if they are treating their workers ok, the Union won't be necessary. IF they start cutting salaries and benefits, they will open the door for the unions THEMSELVES.
Sorry your "educated" folks couldn't do better and find better work. It's a free country....an accountant and inspector should be able to go somewhere else. And I have a feeling that carpet mills are far different from automobile plants.
Also, when was that sob story? 1970ish? I have a feeling things have changed. Sure, there are bad jobs and bad environments, but it’s the freedom as a citizen of the USA to find better and make better for yourself.
To sum up: Bad job? Go get a better one. Unions just make the economy worse and stifle the free market. Good companies will pay what you’re worth. Unions will force good companies to pay crap like they’re the best ever.
With the attack on coal coming I really don't know what is going to support our goverment-
It would be so nice to ride the tide until the encon gets moving again-
Yeah.....so why are the factories that are non-union doing so well? And always have done well?
Unions strangle free markets and add artificial restrictions, plainand simple. So start your union, and watch the jobs leave the area to go down south.
Of course, in Obama's economy, I guess job loss would be just about the status quo....So Go For It!!
nnn
The 'key' word is "talking". The employees @ Toyota are too intelligent to join the UAW, which has put the 'BIG THREE' out of business.